# Gardens and Fairy Tales of The Collaborative Future
#### da0/g0v’s chat w/ Martin Honzik, CCO of Ars Electronica’s Festival
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Ars Electronica Linz is a internationally renowned new media art festival in Austria, founded in September 1979. g0v was awarded with the prize of digital community in 2020, da0 thought it'd be fun to bring g0v and Ars Electronica together again, and see what might spark interesting conversations this time. Martin is the Chief Cultural Officer and managing director of Ars Electronica, needless to say, we're quite excited to pick his brain.
We were sitting in a kitchen at our usual co-working space, sky’s a bit gloomy, maybe we were a little bit too, it’s a Sunday afternoon after all. We moved the desks to the sides and circled the chairs so the conversation seems more like a real fire chat. Martin was a bit late, but lit up the room immediately when he walked in, he greeted everyone with a big smile, sat down and leaned forward, to listen. Coming from entirely different backgrounds, I think we were all looking for the intersections of our interests, how might art and civic tech crossover? But it is something Mashbean, a da0 project owner and the host of this event, had in his mindset already..
Mashbean started to explain how the interest of decentralization evolved over time in Taiwan and how g0v has been experimenting with such an organizational structure since 10 years ago. So here are some of the insights that we’ve gathered and thought would be helpful for the world moving forward.
## Subversion
“You guys are the future.” This is what Martin said after listening to Chihao, a long-time g0v contributor, explaining what g0v has done for the past 10 years. By “you” we believe Martin meant new collaborative models to be imagined by the younger generation. We talked about the very recent crypto tragedies, billions vanished into thin air and millions disappeared from Twitter, about how web3, being the steroids of capitalism, has been in the hands of those not to build for a better world, but to build for individual wealth & quick money, which renders the disaster we all experience, even from afar.
Martin pointed out it’s very important to take another look at how we “trade”. Now we’re still doing everything in the capitalistic manner, still build the same conveyor belt, and the people at the end of those conveyor belt still gets fucked over, over and over. The professors of economics in universities still teach the same old principles, renowned economists still win Nobel Prizes for the wrong shit, and our system still praises the accomplishments of capitalism, without exploring other possibilities. And that’s why this conversation is so important, that’s why we need to bring more collaboration into the education systems, and we need to build a new education system that brings the world together, not to divide it.
The values that we use to build up our lives and careers need to change, we need to learn to appreciate something new. The US won the world in the past era, the American way of thinking, especially with economies and capitalism, dominated our lives, “Be the first, take it, when nothing is here, off to new shores.”. But what happens when there are no new shores? Capitalism should be for the past, not the future. The shift of values needs to be based on different principles, we are all global citizens, this is not about nationalists, not at all. We need to find a new ways to build for global collaborations, regardless of how big the challenge is.
We can transform, or we’d be transformed.
Subversion is creativity. The young, the new generation has developed the necessity for subversion. We need to trust the younger generation, and we need to be better older people. We can’t just protect the existing system that’s driving the world to the ground. We need to talk about what is value, and we need to talk about what is currency, we can’t continue to think about value only as money, we’ll need to think about this complex problem if we want future generations to remain on this planet.
## Make Gardens, Build Communities
Martin talks about how he struggles with what’s going on with the world, he talks about how he wants to stand up and to change, but he couldn’t, he feels his own smallness among those world superpowers, whether it be countries or crypto billionaires. Taiwan is no different, we are isolated politically and economically, we struggle with finding our own national and individual identities. What can we do to change the world from such a powerless position?
The answer is community.
Martin used gardens as metaphor, we need to find the connections and resources among us, if we all each make gardens, and we find a way to collaborate, we make mountains, not just monuments.
This coincides with a metaphor da0 uses to define itself as a decentralized organization. We think of ourselves as a forest, and everyone in da0 as a tree, we encourage everyone to build their own aspirations towards a common mission, we nurture but we don’t control, a tree can grow any way or anywhere it wants, this way everyone maximizes the chances to achieve self-realization, and as a community we make mountain-like changes.
Martin also reminded us that under the ground, the roots connect all plants as well as exchange nutrition and carbon. It’s the underlying connections that matters. The ecology can be a reference for people who wants to peek into an alternative world.
We don’t really “need” new technologies, we don’t really “need” new monuments, but we need new intelligence to see things in new ways, in ourselves and in nature. “I have to believe in this” Martin said.
Technology should not be used to make the next billionaire, not the next Jeff (Bezos) or the next Mark (Zuckerberg). We are already quite familiar with that narrative, and the endings of those stories have not been the greatest, at least not to those at the end of the conveyor belts.
## Fairy Tales
Martin told a story about hosting this year’s Ars Electronica. The team didn’t want people to come in cars for the late night shows, and naturally they made a deal with the local government for late night public transportations, but they also wanted people to come in bikes, so they asked the neighborhood door by door to turn on their porch lights on that night, and they did, and everyone biked home safely. As we discuss new collaborative models, this simple act of knocking on people’s doors might just be a start. Values were aligned, conversations instead of negotiations were made, we just need to do what makes sense for the many.
Contradictions are part of democracy, when people disagree with us, we don’t need to shut down or fight back, we can be curious, this does not mean we need to change our minds, this means we expand our own horizons, in this new horizon we might just find our roles in this possible future.
In technology we often use the term “forking”, it means if you don’t like something, copy and make it your own, this is often used in open source and blockchain communities. But it comes back to how we as human beings deal with contradictions, if forking is an option, do we fork to fight, or do we fork to complement each other?
Fairy tales, bedtime stories are important social rituals that transfer and form values. If we can find a ritual to teach our societies to change, and if we link this to our national, individual or cultural identities, we might find ourselves a new future ahead.
We felt very connected to Martin, in many ways what we believe in is what Martin believes in, he said he felt very happy to be invited, we say we felt very honored to be connected. Thank you Martin for your wonderful words, your wonderful presence, and your wonderful friendship.
# 合作未來的花園和童話
#### da0/g0v’s chat w/ Martin Honzik, CCO of Ars Electronica’s Festival
林茲電子藝術節在1979年9月創立，是國際知名的新媒體藝術活動。2020年零時政府獲得了數位社群獎，而da0認為讓零時政府和Ars Electronica重逢會很有趣，希望能看看會擦出怎樣的火花。Martin 是 Ars Electronica 的文化長兼總監，我們很高興能聽聽他對未來的想法。
我們坐在我們常用的共同工作空間的廚房裡，天空有點陰沉，也許我們也有點陰沉，畢竟這是一個星期天的下午。 我們把桌子移到兩邊，把椅子圍成一圈，這樣談話看起來更像是一場真正的火聊。 馬丁來晚了一點，但他一走進來就立刻把房間照亮了，他笑著和大家打招呼，然後坐下來，身體前傾，聽著。 來自完全不同的背景，我想我們都在尋找我們興趣的交集，藝術和公民科技如何交叉？而這是身為 da0 項目主理人之一及本次活動主持人的 Mashbean 已經有備而來的課題..
Mashbean 開始解釋去中心化的興趣在台灣是如何隨著時間的推移而演變，以及 g0v 如何從 10 年前開始嘗試這種組織結構。以下是我們收集的一些見解，認為這些見解將有助於世界向前發展。
## 顛覆
「你們就是未來。」Martin在聽了g0v資深貢獻者知澔解釋這個社群過去10年所達成的事情後這麼說。我們認為 Martin 所說的「你」指的是年輕一代可以想像的新協作模式。我們談到了最近的加密悲劇，數十億人消失在空氣中，數百萬人從 Twitter 上消失了，關於 web3 作為資本主義的類固醇，如何掌握在那些不是為了建設更美好世界，而是為了個人建設的人手中財富和快錢，這使我們所有人都經歷過災難，即使是在遠方。
馬丁指出，重新審視我們如何「交易」非常重要。現在我們仍然以資本主義的方式做所有事情，仍然建造相同的傳送帶，而那些傳送帶末端的人仍然一遍又一遍地被操。大學裡的經濟學教授仍然在教授同樣的舊原理，著名的經濟學家仍然因為錯誤的狗屎而獲得諾貝爾獎，我們的製度仍然在讚美資本主義的成就，而沒有探索其他可能性。這就是為什麼這次對話如此重要，這就是為什麼我們需要在教育系統中引入更多合作，我們需要建立一個新的教育系統，讓世界團結在一起，而不是分裂它。
我們用來建立生活和事業的價值觀需要改變，我們需要學會欣賞新事物。美國在過去的時代贏得了世界，美國的思維方式，尤其是經濟和資本主義的思維方式主導了我們的生活，「成為第一個，抓住它，當這裡什麼都沒有的時候，去新的海岸。」。但是當沒有新的海岸時會發生什麼？資本主義應該是為了過去，而不是未來。價值觀的轉變需要基於不同的原則，我們都是全球公民，這與民族主義者無關，根本不是。無論挑戰有多大，我們都需要找到一種新的方式來建立全球合作。
我們可以轉變，否則我們就會被轉變。
顛覆就是創造力。年輕的新一代已經發展出顛覆的必要性。我們需要信任年輕一代，我們需要成為更好的老年人。我們不能僅僅保護將世界推向地面的現有系統。我們需要談什麼是價值，我們需要談什麼是貨幣，我們不能繼續只把價值當成錢來想，我們要讓子孫後代繼續下去，就需要考慮這個複雜的問題這個星球。
## 建造花園，建設社區
馬丁談到他如何與世界正在發生的事情作鬥爭，他談到他如何想站起來改變，但他做不到，他感到自己在那些世界超級大國中的渺小，無論是國家還是加密億萬富翁.台灣也不例外，我們在政治和經濟上都是孤立的，我們努力尋找自己的民族和個人身份。我們可以做些什麼來改變世界從這樣一個無能為力的位置？
答案是社區。
馬丁用花園來比喻，我們需要找到我們之間的聯繫和資源，如果我們每個人都建造花園，並且我們找到合作的方式，我們就會建造山脈，而不僅僅是紀念碑。
這與 da0 用來將自己定義為去中心化組織的比喻不謀而合。我們認為自己是一片森林，da0 中的每個人都是一棵樹，我們鼓勵每個人為共同的使命建立自己的願望，我們培育但我們不控制，一棵樹可以隨心所欲地生長，這每個人都最大化實現自我實現的機會，作為一個社區，我們做出了巨大的變化。
馬丁還提醒我們，在地下，根部連接所有植物並交換營養和碳，重要的是底層連接。生態可以為想窺探異世界的人提供參考。
我們並不真正「需要」新技術，我們並不真正「需要」新的紀念碑，但我們需要新的智慧來以新的方式看待我們自己和自然界中的事物。馬丁說：「我必須相信這一點。」
技術不應該被用來造就下一個億萬富翁，下一個貝佐斯（Jeff Bezos）或下一個祖克柏（Mark Zuckerberg），我們已經很熟悉這種說法了，這些故事的結局都不是最偉大的，至少對那些結尾的人來說不是傳送帶。
## 童話故事
Martin 講述了一個關於舉辦今年的 Ars Electronica 的故事。深夜演出的團隊不希望人們開車來，自然和當地政府就深夜公共交通達成協議，但他們也希望人們騎自行車來，所以他們問了附近的門那天晚上，他們打開門廊的燈，他們照做了，每個人都安全地騎車回家。當我們討論新的協作模式時，這種敲門的簡單行為可能只是一個開始。價值觀是一致的，進行了對話而不是談判，我們只需要做對許多人有意義的事情。
矛盾是民主的一部分，當人們不同意我們時，我們不需要關閉或反擊，我們可以好奇，這並不意味著我們需要改變主意，這意味著我們擴大了自己的視野，在這個新的地平線，我們可能只是在這個可能的未來找到我們的角色。
在資訊科技的領域裡，我們經常使用「分叉」（forking）這個詞。它的意思是如果你不喜歡某樣東西，複製它並把它變成你自己的，這在開源和區塊鏈社區中經常使用。但這又回到我們人類如何處理矛盾的問題上，如果分叉是一種選擇，我們分叉是為了戰鬥，還是分叉是為了互補？
童話、睡前故事是傳遞和形成價值觀的重要社會儀式。如果我們能找到一種儀式來教導我們的社會改變，如果我們將其與我們的國家、個人或文化身份聯繫起來，我們可能會發現自己前方的新未來。
我們覺得與 Martin 在想法上深有聯繫，在很多方面我們所相信的就是 Martin 所相信的，他說他很高興被邀請，我們說我們很榮幸能被聯繫起來。感謝 Martin 的精彩演講、精彩的出席和美好的友誼。